Posts by Island Man

29

Need clarification from someone who speaks JW: What is an "apostate" ...or... an "apostate website?"

by Faithful Witness in

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2015/jul/27/jehovahs-witnesses-destroyed-notes-about-child-sex-abuse-inquiry-told.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/27/us-australia-religion-sexcrimes-iduskcn0q10ih20150727.

http://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2015/07/28/australia-jehovah-witness-sex-abuse-hannigan-lklv.cnn.

Island Man

Officially, Watchtower defines an apostate as a baptized JW who rejects bible teachings as taught by Jehovah's Witnesses. So a JW does not have to voluntarily leave the organization to be an apostate. He can be disfellowshipped for apostasy if adamantly disagrees with Watchtower teachings.

Since JWs teach that a person must worship God as part of their organization to have God's favor, the word apostate also applies to any who disassociates from the organization - even without them being openly critical of its teachings or campaigning against it.

That's the official position. Unofficially, however, most JWs use the word apostate to refer only to JWs who become critics of the organization and its teachings and actively campaign to influence JWs into leaving the organization. They also use the word apostate as an adjective to refer to information that is critical of their teachings and organization.

The true dictionary definition of the word apostate means someone who has abandoned or rejected a religion or cause they once supported. When JWs start talking about apostates you can ask the JW what religion he was before he became a JW and why he left that religion. Then you tell the JW: "You're an apostate of [insert religion]! Why should I believe anything you have to say about them?"

24

Interesting Article: New human link found "Homo Naledi"

by Splash in

haven't read it all yet, but 15 skeletons have been found in south africa, near jo'burg... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/11855405/homo-naledi-a-new-species-of-human-discovered-in-a-cave-in-south-africa.html.

Island Man

This was just an ape that resembles humans more closely and the evolution-biased Darwinists are wrongly claiming that it is an evolutionary ancestor of humans. Plus the carbon dating is messed up because of changes due to the flood. The scientists don't know what they're talking about. True christians reject worldly wisdom in favor of bible truth.

36

Could "this generation" inspire a new "1975 debacle"?

by Island Man in

i think that it's possible that they're getting ready to issue a new end time date insinuation like they did with 1975. now i know what some of you are probably thinking: why would they be so stupid as to repeat such a mistake, knowing what happened in 1975?

well here're two reasons why i think they could do it:.

first, it's important to remember that they are deluded.

Island Man

Bear in mind that 20xx would not be the date prediction for the end but merely the maximum projected deadline for the end. They could play up this technicality to emphasize that they're not making a prediction of when the end is coming but merely pointing out the finite lifespan of "this generation" and that the end can come well before that date.

That way they can create the effect of a date prediction while at the same time not making an actual date prediction and emphasizing the point that they aren't making a date prediction. That way, the dubs will be more inclined to accept the non-prediction without Matthew 24:36 causing them any cognitive dissonance.

36

Could "this generation" inspire a new "1975 debacle"?

by Island Man in

i think that it's possible that they're getting ready to issue a new end time date insinuation like they did with 1975. now i know what some of you are probably thinking: why would they be so stupid as to repeat such a mistake, knowing what happened in 1975?

well here're two reasons why i think they could do it:.

first, it's important to remember that they are deluded.

Island Man

I think that it's possible that they're getting ready to issue a new end time date insinuation like they did with 1975. Now I know what some of you are probably thinking: why would they be so stupid as to repeat such a mistake, knowing what happened in 1975? Well here're two reasons why I think they could do it:

First, it's important to remember that they are deluded. They really believe that the end is coming within "this generation" so it's easy for them to tell themselves that even if they were wrong in the past they now have a better handle on the timeline. Setting a specific target date would also inspire fear and urgency in JWs, scaring sleeping fence-sitters and unbaptized publishers as well as ignorant members of the public into becoming full-fledged loyal, baptized members of the religion. It will boost their membership.

Second, they can rationalize their claim and give it credence by saying that they're not really setting a date for the end. This is what I believe they can do: They can conduct a global survey of all congregations to determine the youngest surviving member of group 2 of the overlapping generation. They can then use this person's current age and an estimated maximum life-expectancy + a few years for safety, to determine a maximum end date for "this generation". Then they can publish in a Watchtower that "this generation" is projected to continue up to 20xx for the absolute latest, followed by something like:

"Can we conclude then that this wicked system will end in 20xx? No, we cannot make such specific predictions because Jesus clearly said no one knows the day or the hour. But he did tell us the generation. That generation's end point - this generation's end point - is clearly discernible and fast approaching! Jesus said "this generation will not pass away until all these things occur"! Evidently, the end of this wicked system must come some time before 20xx. We do not know the day or the hour but we do know the deadline!"

And so this line of reasoning can implant the date 20xx in the minds of JWs creating as much hype over that date as existed regarding the 1975 date. And they can rationalize away any criticisms of their claims based on Jesus' statement about no one knowing the day, by saying that they're not claiming to know the day, that the end can come anytime before 20xx - only it must come before then.

I can totally see this happening.

26

the purpose of generation explanation

by poopie in

jw
friends

ok here is my 2 cents they are getting complaints concerning the drum beat that goes we are in the last hour of last min bla bla bla and people are tired and want system to end so if the system is ended sooon then why are there new partakers assuming that most have the actually calling.

so now we have a problem how do we fix it?

simple just say those new annointed are not part of this generation so now if we appoint younger guys to gb not to worry there not a part of this generation.

Island Man

I think that it's possible that they're getting ready to issue a new end time date insinuation like they did with 1975.

Now I know what some of you are probably thinking: why would they be so stupid as to repeat such a mistake, knowing what happened in 1975? Well here're two reasons why I think they will do it:

First, it's important to remember that they are deluded. They really believe that the end is coming within "this generation" so it's easy for them to tell themselves that even if they were wrong in the past they now have a better handle on the timeline.

Second, they will rationalize their claim by saying that they're not really setting a date for the end. This is what I believe they will do: They will conduct a global survey to determine the youngest surviving member of group 2 of the overlapping generation. They will use this person's current age and an estimated maximum life-expectancy + a few years for safety, to determine a maximum end date for "this generation". Then they will publish in a Watchtower that "this generation" is projected to continue up to 20xx for the absolute latest. Then they will say something like:

"Can we conclude then that this wicked system will end in 20xx? No, we cannot make such specific predictions because Jesus clearly said no one knows the day or the hour. But he did tell us the generation. That generation's end point - this generation's end point - is clearly discernible and fast approaching! Jesus said "this generation will not pass away until all these things occur"! Evidently, the end of this wicked system must come some time before 20xx. We do not know the day or the hour but we do know the deadline!"

And so this line of reasoning will implant the date 20xx in the minds of JWs creating as much hype over that date as existed regarding the 1975 date. And they will rationalize away Jesus' statement about no one knowing the day by saying that they're not claiming to know the day, that the end can come anytime before 20xx - only it must come before then.

I can totally see this happening.

36

What ARE the fruits that the JW tree produces?

by TTWSYF in

my brother [the elder] often refers to this line as to 'knowing a tree by it;s fruits'.

so,my question is what are the jw fruits?.

just asking....sincerely.

Island Man

~ Organization worship.

~ Religious superiority complex

~ Blind, unconditional obedience and loyalty

~ Inability to think critically and independently

~ Group think

~ Inability to speak freely

~ Irrational phobia induction

~ Willful ignorance and fear of disconfirming information

~ Closed mindedness

~ Prejudice, bigotry and profiling of outsiders

~ Institutionalized hypocrisy

~ Institutionalized secrecy

~ Emphasis on outward appearances

~ Pharisaic rule making

~ Use of deceptive spin speak to cover up the ugly aspects of the religion.

~ Healthy social and family relationships are subordinated to cult devotion.

~ Family ostracism and shunning of those that leave or express contrary opinions.

~ Psychological and emotional manipulation

~ Non-participation in efforts to better the world and labeling such efforts as a show of lack of faith in God's kingdom.

~ Selfishness in times of disaster - offering practical assistance almost exclusively to other JWs.

~ Demon paranoia

~ Distortion of language - redefining words to suit doctrinal agenda.

~ Love of being right and love of the thought of being in the only true religion takes precedence over love of actual truth.

60

New light from GB member David Splane!

by Island Man in

in the latest jw broadcast splane is quoted as saying:.

"suppose there was a man who died 10 minutes before joseph was born.

would he be part of joseph's generation?

Island Man

According to David Splane, a person doesn't start living until after they're born! In the latest JW broadcast Splane is quoted as saying:

"Suppose there was a man who died 10 minutes before Joseph was born. Would he be part of Joseph's generation? No. Because he had never lived at the same time as Joseph, he was not a contemporary of Joseph's. Now suppose there was a little baby who was born 10 minutes after Joseph died. Would the baby be part of Joseph's generation? Again, no. Because the baby would not have lived at the same time as Joseph." - JW Broadcast 9/2015, 00:04:00+

Splane essentially stated that a person who dies 10 minutes before a baby is born does not live during that baby's lifetime. This obviously means one thing - babies start living only after they're born. Before they're born, they're not yet alive! lol.

I suppose then that JWs will revise their position on abortions - because you can't kill an unborn child if it's not living yet, can you?

1

Good information to have when JWs and other bible-thumpers start appealing to the authority of the bible.

by Island Man in

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp5ldeld_0o.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=riipk-fxicc.

Island Man

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BP5LdELd_0o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiiPK-FXicc

44

Anybody have any "REAL" experiences of spirit/demon activity? I'll explain.

by runForever in

jw
friends

i know there is a lot of people on here that will say it is pure make believe but i am interested if anybody has had any real concrete things happen such as something moving or something appearing in the mirror etc.. anything just post it up here even if it wasn't much.

please give a little context as to the situation..

Island Man

mana11, I can think of one possible explanation for the experience with the dogs howling in a chain sequence.

Dogs will generally howl in response to any sound that they perceive as being similar to a howl. For example, you may have noticed that dogs will start howling in response to the sound of an ambulance siren. In their dog mind, the ambulance siren sounds like the strange howl of some strange dog. And since dogs are social creatures, when a dog hears a howl it usually howls back in response. So when we put these facts together a very plausible explanation arises for the chain howling phenomenon that you experienced. Here is what could have happened:

A dog some great distance away at "ground zero" (too far away to be in your hearing) heard the sound of an ambulance siren or some other sound produced by some kind of equipment or machinery. The sound of this equipment or machinery was interpreted by the dog as being the sound or howl produced by a very large and vicious alpha male threatening to attack. Or maybe it was interpreted by the dog as being the sound of an unidentified and unknown horrible creature - perhaps the sound of some now extinct predatory creature that terrorized dogs' ancestors in the past. (A fearful response to the sound of such a creature, leading the dogs to issue a warning howl and take evasive action, would have provided an evolutionary survival advantage and so that trait could have been selected for and passed down to modern dogs.)

So when this dog at ground zero some great distance away heard the sound it responded in terror with frightful howl. Now because of the social nature of dogs, the next dog within hearing hears this howl and howls in response then the next dog in the hearing of this other dog also hears and response - a domino effect is created and the howl travels from dog to dog all the way from the source sound - which was too far away for you to hear - all the way down to your neighborhood. And the domino effect of the howl gives you the illusion that something is traveling and disturbing each dog when it comes into proximity. In reality though, its just the howling equivalent of a "Mexican wave".

39

The Paranormal

by Peony in

jw
friends

i'm interested to know if anyone has been to see a medium/clairvoyant since leaving jw's.

i must admit now i can make my own choices i seem to have a fascination with it although haven't acted on it as a) am i just jumping into believing another load of rubbish?

and b) what if it really is the demons pretending to be loved ones!!

Island Man

I haven't but that's because I now know that all the paranormal stuff is really a load of rubbish. No alleged paranormal events or abilities have ever stood up to professional scientific testing and scrutiny.

It's all charlatanry and exploiting the brain's pattern seeking mechanisms to deceive people. Many natural neurological phenomena are often mistaken for paranormal activity. For example, many people who are unaware of the phenomenon of sleep paralysis interpret the experience as someone putting a curse on them or a demon paralyzing them.

Credulity + ignorance = belief in the paranormal. Knowledge of how the mind works + critical thinking skills = seeing the paranormal for the bs that it really is.